Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	And the winner is..............
Date:	12/16/2018 11:55:32 AM

https://www.axios.com/auto-manufacturing-jobs-gain-in-southern-states-aed9d3ed-72bf-41a9-9447-adb28446357f.html

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/17/2018 8:53:54 PM (updated 12/17/2018 8:54:30 PM)

Here’s a link from the article you shared. Winner?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-03-23/inside-alabama-s-auto-jobs-boom-cheap-wages-little-training-crushed-limbs

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/17/2018 9:29:18 PM (updated 12/17/2018 9:30:18 PM)

I don't recall hearing about the auto manufacturing draft.

The point is some people have a choice.  And a choice is better than no choice.

Robots have a very simple hemisphere of influence.  You shut the power off before you occupy that hemisphere.

Pitiful that some can't remember one simple important rule. 

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/18/2018 12:09:04 AM

Your short-sightedness is stunning

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/18/2018 10:26:07 AM

These OSHA violations are indeed a problem and in my experience will eventually get resolved.  We do a lot of health and safety work with clients and these kind of incidents are fairly common with new manufacturing facilities and as the workforce gets more experience they tend to decrease.  I think there is also a cultural issue here with the Korean parts suppliers.  They simply don't have the same level of concern for employees as we do in the U.S.  That will change over time as they begin to understand that their business practices are not acceptable here adn will continue to cost them money over the long haul.  So I would expect these issues will go away over time and if not, OSHA will shut them down.

I will comment on the one story about the young woman who died.  Unless the company didn't have Lock-Out Tag-Out (LOTO) procedures in place she likely violated safety rules.  They don't say in the article that there were no LOTO procedures so I suspect that there were and she mistakenly violated them.  At many of our client manufacturing facilities they have very detailed and specific procedures for equipment repairs and workers have them drummed into their heads.  If the plant didn't provide that training they are liable.  Wasn't clear whether the young woman had that training and in desparation to make production quotas she went against them or she was poorly trained.  Either way it is tragic and something with their safety culture and training has to change.

On the wage front, these are highly desired entry level jobs because they recognize they can lead to more lucrative pay with good benefits.  If they weren't, people wouldn't flock to get one of these jobs.  But comparing wages in the southeast to the midwest makes the case for why companies locate here.  They are able to attract good employees at lower wages because of the cost of living, taxes, etc. are lower in states like Alabama.  That is actually called free markets and it is perfectly reasonable for companies to move their manufacturing plants to this part of the country.  

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	QUIET-IDIOT
Date:	12/18/2018 12:35:16 PM

Your liberal stupidity to support liberal failing communist unions is even more stunning.

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	WIX - STILL the IGNORANT BIGOT
Date:	12/18/2018 10:28:51 PM (updated 12/18/2018 10:34:58 PM)

Go back to your cellar, ignorant bigot. I’m not sure how you even function above ground

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/18/2018 10:33:32 PM

Pedantic comments don’t suit you, MM. it’s simple to understanf why companies relocate here. And although time will tell there is also a reason plaintiff’s lawyers like to bring cases to Alabama - jury’s here pay like slot machines. They don’t call it tort heaven for nuthin. We used to do anything we could to settle in order to avoid juries here. It’s a real contrast to tort reform mentality. 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 8:39:11 AM

Ad hominem attacks seem to suit you very well.  I reasonably provide my direct experience with these kind of issues and your response was to accuse me of being pedantic.  Sorry that I know so much about this particular topic......well actually, I'm not sorry because it's a result of 30 years of hard work.

And yes, Alabama is pretty bad when it comes to lawsuits but in the southeast it doesn't hold a candle to Mississippi and Louisiana.  Like I said, these companies will get their act together or will cease to be able to do business.  As we joke in our business, the only difference between God and an OSHA inspector is that God doesn't think he's an OSHA inspector (with due apologies to fire inspectors everywhere).  Between them and plaintiff's attorneys they will change their business practices or they will go out of business.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/19/2018 8:45:29 AM

Hatred of unions, lax or non-existant regulations, Cheap, ignorant and poorly schooled labor and lax or non-existant regulations with all these aspects supported by crooked politicians!  This has been the south's main selling point to industrial developers since the end of the Civil War.  Thankfully that is changing in at least some areas of our beloved region inspite of the efforts of rightwingers that still dominate our legislatures.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Is it Really a Winner?
Date:	12/19/2018 8:47:03 AM

Cheap, ignorant and poorly schooled labor - you mean like the "migrants" storming our southern border that you support?

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic - all across the board
Date:	12/19/2018 9:39:21 AM (updated 12/19/2018 9:58:04 AM)

Well, if the shoe fits...

I cant help it if you don’t like the shoe

”Being showy of one's knowledge, often in a boring manner.” 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 9:58:19 AM

You just don't like educated people do you?  As for me, I like very much hearing from others and learning from them and never find it boring.  But then again, I am not a liberal that prefers emotion over facts, logic and reason and likes to believe so much that just isn't true.  Staying in ignorance is no virtue but if you prefer that then who am I to judge?

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Yet again
Date:	12/19/2018 1:21:07 PM

please refer to a single post where I said I support the entry of illegal migrants into our country.  I do support humane treatment of all human beings and I do support the entry of those fleeing for their or their families lives and I do support a complete overhaul of our immigration system and the laws behind it.  I do not support the wholesale entry of undocumented persons at any border and defy you to show otherwise!

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hummmm, then
Date:	12/19/2018 1:22:38 PM (updated 12/19/2018 1:25:51 PM)

Why would you place me or anybody else on "ignore"?  I might also inquire as to why you have never commented on the fact that Trump got only 42% of the college grad's votes but 70% of the white high school vote!

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Yet again
Date:	12/19/2018 2:35:12 PM (updated 12/19/2018 2:48:24 PM)

Antifatech - "

The brown people are coming and they are only 1200 miles away and will be here in only 2 months and, just like like last time, a dozen of them might actually be admitted on a lagitimate political asylum basis.

Are you people too blinded by political bias to see this crap as the Trump ordered diversion* it is?"

I missed your previously posted racist "brown people" comment, but since you wanted me to pull up documentation - well this one was recent in my memory and a easy find.  So while you do not state "I support illegals storming the border" your lets not worry about border security because its months away and maybe a few dozen might get across, like last time(which I would love to see your documentation of when a caravan only had a "dozen" get across.  Its just a ordered up diversion. 

Does not sound like you have any problems with people storming our borders as long as you can blame it on Trump, its months away so lets not worry about it and that in your opinion only a few got acrossl ast time- when in reality there are milllions of illegals in this country and more coming daily leading to a bigger and bigger problem.

And while you " do support the entry of those fleeing for their or their families lives ", is that a statement of actual asylum where they fear the lives due to drugs lords/dictators/government fear - or is that the more liberal definition of "I want a job in the USA and welfare"  I feel that you carefully worded your statement to avoid actually saying that the illegals that are storming our border should be accepted not because of fear of government opression - but more liberally accepted things like climate change.  I woke up and it felt like it was warmer then yesterday and thought I was going to die so decided to migrate to America, steal someones identity and get a job at Antifatechs latest build for $3 a day building porches and cutting grass. 

"I do support a complete overhaul of our immigration system and the laws behind it"

Well since you support the complete overhaul of our laws - please feel free to expand and explain to all of us in your own pedantic words exactly what you would allow and what should not be allowed in Antifatech land.

Should just anyone be allowed to cross a border?

Should they have to go through some welness check?

Should we have a border?

Should people only be accepted at ports of entry?

Is a job cutting grass or building porchs a good reason to cross the border?

I didnt get enough for breakfast this morning and I might die without a snack - so lets migrate?

Please feel free to educate us on your wish list of law changes.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	And again
Date:	12/19/2018 3:07:05 PM (updated 12/19/2018 3:18:06 PM)

http://www.lakesonline.com/Forum/show.asp?id=197165&fid=D2493503-C07E-408B-A0FF-3F590C1FBF78&SiteID=AL004

You are undercutting your own claims of how wonderful the Trump economy is.  If unemployment, thanks to Dear Leader, is at a 50 year low then how can you support the claim that ANYBODY is having a job cut out from under them.  We have a damn labor shortage!  We need more people willing to work, not less.  Anybody that wants a job can get one!  Think for a change...it won't make your brain explode!

http://www.lakesonline.com/Forum/show.asp?id=197171&fid=D2493503-C07E-408B-A0FF-3F590C1FBF78&SiteID=AL004

You really are dense! All those low paying jobs you are bitching about the caravaners "taking" from Americans are the jobs that are going begging because there is not enough American supply to fill the American demand...it's called a market economy.  If all 7000 get in (last caravan only a dozen or so did) it would not put one lawyer or nurse out of work but it might make it maybe slightly easier for some lawyers and nurses to get a cleaning lady or yard man or somebody to repair their drywall or Paint their kitchen or build them a deck a little quicker, easier and without having to sell their first born to pay for it!  Try to understand, I know it's hard but you can do it!

Care to go into detail about how this is not just open borders migration/cheap jobs/ over a cutting grass/drywall/build a deck? or is this really about "Fear"?

So we can have a few thousand to a million or so flood the labor market to cut grass,clean houses, build porches and slap up drywall and/or paint by your definition of "fear of their lives".......

You really are racist and for open borders - admitting it to yourself is the first step...Personally I always hire the undocumented/uninsured to work on my house, around my wfe and family because they are cheaper. 

Wait ,no I dont - because I value my family, want it built/fixed right by someone who is reputable and when there is a problem with the job -  I am not trying to find a needle in the parking lot of Home Depot.  I have a phone number, address and business and it helps when they are bonded and insured vs someone handing me a expired drivers license with someone elses picture.  Hell I can even locate little Jimmy down the street the summer I paid to get my grass cut when he decided to skip the back yard.

Name:	QuietMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 3:27:53 PM

I like educated people - and surround myself with them. Especially those who are open-minded and whose perspective is not driven solely by FOX colored glasses. Your constant reference to logic and reason is cover for your opinions and nothing more. And yes, you could benefit from economy of words. 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Brevity
Date:	12/19/2018 3:30:46 PM

Here's some word economy.  I've seen nothing you post that suggests you spend much time around intelligent people....or it doesn't rub off.  Second, I never watch FoxNews. Keep digging......

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 3:31:17 PM (updated 12/19/2018 3:33:07 PM)

Sounds more like you prefer your echo chamber and are not as open minded as you think.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 4:52:37 PM

Not only that, but he thinks posting links to some article is akin to intelligence.  He posts some link that I commented on and then he whines about my comment being too long.  I suppose a cartoon or a tweet are more understandable for him.  One more liberal failed by his govt school.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Pedantic? Hmmmmm......
Date:	12/19/2018 5:08:10 PM

Now that's something he might be able to understand although there are lots of words.  Instead of posting the actual cartoon you should have posted a link so all he has to do it click on it.  Words are so hard, especially when you string them into sentences and paragraphs.  It's all too much to bear!!!  Just give him a hash tag and he'll feel better.  #mygovtschoolfailedme or #factsandlogicaremean

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Winner is not QUIET-IDIOT or ARCH-COMMIE......
Date:	12/19/2018 6:04:37 PM

You two liberal know nothin’, lyin’ jerks just got your butts handed to ya.  Get outta here....

Name:	MAJ USA RET -	Reply
Subject:	...but, eye opening
Date:	12/19/2018 8:59:50 PM

I was OSHA 29 CFR 1920.120 and OSHA 29 CFR 1926.32(f) certified. I WORKED under those restrictions/requirements. There was NEVER anything heinous about that. I never found anything especially burdensome about the requirements. We were frequently inspected… and NEVER cited for violations. Guess what… our accident rate was clean.

Before I was (reluctantly) embroiled in the process… I had nothing but apprehension about OSHA.

But I AM a convert. This seems to be an instance where the government took control from the unions… to create safe work environments. AND, thus expediting the demise of the corrupt unions.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	RACIST WIX THE WEASEL
Date:	12/19/2018 10:23:20 PM

Dude, you hurt my feelings....you left me out. Thanks alot.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	RACIST WIX THE WEASEL
Date:	12/19/2018 10:56:03 PM

Left yourself out?  Why complain?

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	RACIST WIX THE WEASEL
Date:	12/20/2018 1:45:02 AM

https://www.facebook.com/MabeInAmerica/videos/266511600698405/