Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/10/2016 10:11:10 AM

Interesting outcome in Maine when they included a requirement for able bodied people between 18 and 49 and without children to work in order to receive food stamps.  If they refused they were removed from eligibility for food stamps.  And the requirements are not at all onerous.  They either have to work or participate in state-provided training programs or community service.  In essence, get off your lazy butts and do something.  Amazingly, 80% of them said no thanks.  They were more willing to give up their EBT card than they were willing to work or train or provide community service.

If you look at the numbers on food stamps it has essentially been unchanged from its peak during the recession despite the so-called Obama recovery.  I suspect that as we saw with welfare reform, if there was a similar requirement across the nation the numbers on food stamps would drop significantly.  In Maine alone they spend $84B a year for food stamps on able bodied people without children.  Imagine what the number is nationwide.  

Now let's suppose Maine is an outlier and nationally a much lower percentage stick with their EBT cards and either get a job, train or provide community service.  That would be fine with me as my assumption is they really do need the assistance and are willing to work for it.  And maybe some will improve theior circumstances and eventually no longer need support.  All in all a good thing and an economically conservative approach that I would gladly support.  My cynical side is that far too many would rather give up their EBT card rather than work and I am OK with that as well as that is their right.

Name:	lucky67 -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/10/2016 12:07:54 PM

gosh Maine has more common sense than other states; guess we dont want to offend anyone --

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/10/2016 2:06:06 PM

Can you imagine the screeching by the dimokraps in Alabama if such a wonderful policy was instituted.  Why, half the state would starve to death in less than 24 hours.  o-BAMA would call out the Gestapo.  Man, I wish we could do it tomorrow....of course, half the Walmarts would close within a month...

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/10/2016 8:08:44 PM

MM, consider this.  A person on welfare may have young children, and in order to work - and lets be realistic, it's going to be at some minimum wage job, they have to find and pay for child care.   I wonder if they don't think they would be basically working for nothing. 

I'm not defending welfare or those that collect it.  We've all heard the stories of women popping out babies with multiple men to get their welfare.  Most of them are "veterans" of job training programs, but truthfully, they are never going to find jobs, because they are not educated and are too  ghetto for anyone to want to hire them. 

I had a friend in CT (but she had gone to Auburn) and was from GA.  She was a MSW.  She could not find a job in GA, she had a fear of taking her boards.  She went in lived with her college roommate, but still couldn't find a job.  She went on foodstamps and public assistance.  She finally passed her boards, and got a job, but it was a very low paying job and I think she still collected foodstamps.  Eventually, she got more and more depressed about her life, and in the end, she took her life.  I'm not saying every case is like hers, but I wonder 1/ how many other cases are like hers; 2/ how many people on welfare are basically unemployable. 

Unfortunately, I don't think you're going to be able to walk it back and the best you can hopeful for is to find a way it doesn't expand. 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/11/2016 8:50:02 AM

If you think you can't walk back these programs with sensible reforms how do you explain what happened in Maine?  And how do you explain what happened when they reformed welfare?  In Wisconsin alone the roles on welfare dropped dramatically even before the reforms went into effect.  The point of these reforms is to separate the truly needy from the lazy and as we saw in Maine and with welfare reform in general it actually works.  It's really human nature at work.  As I said, I am all for helping those truly in need and these reforms demonstrate that there are lots of people that truly don't.

As for your example, that is indeed a sad story but I am not sure the connection with the assistance she got.  It sounds like she was struggling with depression and for some reason lost hope.  I had a friend struggling with depression who sadly made the same decision recently and he was employed, married, etc.  He had been diagnosed with cancer but was cancer free but still depressed for some reason. Counseling didn't seem to help.  

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/11/2016 9:40:30 AM

Do you have any information about what the average person on welfare receives each month?  I don't know.  I don't know what percentage of the population in Maine are on public assistance.  If the situation in Maine is improved, that is great.  Wisconsin too.  I think individual states can put in some reforms - but then do these people just move to a more liberal place?  Or do they stay put? 

But what would happen if they tried reforms in places with a hard core welfare population?  Some place like NYC, Comptom CA, Minnesota?  Would we see a significant increase in crime or drugs?

What portion of the U.S. population is collecting public assistance?  I feel just as strongly about SSD as I do about welfare.   You know there must be a lot of people collecting SSD when you have all these lawyers who specialize in getting people SSD.  Why can't these people be made to find jobs?  Just because you can't do the job you used to do doesn't mean you couldn't do another.  A friend of mine who was a lawyer with SS and handling SSD cases.  She said that on the 3rd submission, they were always approved on appeal.  And yet vets, who actually served their country, wait long periods of time for their cases to be adjudicated, and then have to fight for the benefits they deserve.    

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/11/2016 12:34:07 PM (updated 2/11/2016 12:37:06 PM)

Well at the beginning of Obama's term in 2009 there were about 35 million on food stamps.  It rose steadily for the next two years to around 45 million and has stayed fairly steadily ever since.  So the numbers on food stamps actually went up during the so-called recovery which is pretty disappointing.  As for welfare, it costs around $700B-$800B per year on a national basis (of whioch the Feds are around 2/3rds and state/local picks up the rest) although Obama's joke of a budget plans for large increases.  No doubt no one is living large on welfare but when you add up that, food stamps, Medicaid, etc. it is obviously not too awful an existence.  As I said, I am all for helping the truly needy but as we saw with these reforms they seem willing to give it up if they have to do something to keep it.

By the way, typical annual payments are in the $25K-$30K range.  More than I expected and when you add food stamps (which ranges from $2,400 to $12,000 per year depending on the number in the household) and free medical care why would anyone work?

Name:	John boy -	Reply
Subject:	Maine reminds that some people don't want to work
Date:	2/13/2016 2:11:44 AM (updated 2/13/2016 2:14:04 AM)

What would be wrong with hiring  supervisors for a crew of the people on welfare and go around town cleaning lots, repairing sidewalks and cleaning alleys. I also think that a woman could get welfare for one child because everyone makes mistakes but that is all we pay for. She can have as many children as she wants because she must have planned a way to raise the rest without Government support. No  more multiple "Baby Daddies"  Of course this would have to be a program that starts now and would not apply to children now and would be collecting for next 18 years. I knew a woman that told me that if she didnt get SSD that she was going to get a job. Just goes to show what a sad state that the population has become. I say help the seniors, vets and the truly disable they need even more and cut out the deadbeats. Also there are low life that go to multiple counties to collect benefits which that loophole needs to be stopped.They have multiple SS numbers.  I think that if they are able to work that the community should at least get some good out of it. Also you would have to be a U.S. citizen to collect any benefits. We need to have the same imigration policy as the neighboring country has. Getting off my soap box now  !!!!!!!!