Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/25/2017 3:08:20 PM

A number of articles around about Tillerson feeling frustrated and leaving soon.  That's the problem when you put a high powered executive into a job - they expect an amount of automaty to do the job and apparently that is not happeneing.  I hate to see him go, becasue I think he is a vast improvement over the last few SecStates.  I grather from my reading that Bannion is causing a problem for him in challenging his every more and is blocking Tillerson's recommendations for State bureau positions. 

And clearly Sessions is on his way out.  It's not clear to me why Sessions recused himself from the Russia investigation, unless he figured that if he recused himself that if things went bad, he would not be implicated. 

My question is this - how many good people will Trump run through?  He and Steve Bannion cannot singlehandedly run the government. 

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/25/2017 4:12:44 PM

I think Sessions knew if he didn't recuse himself HE would be the focus of media attention and be even less able to do his job than he is now.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/25/2017 4:50:17 PM

I think both Trump and Tillerson are getting an education on the dysfunction of govt and the difficulty in getting anything done when faced with a vast bureaucracy that understands that politicians come and go but they will always be there.  I had hoped that they would be able to cause some positive change and lots of good things have happened.  But the lack of messaging discipline is killing them and Trump is the primary cause of that problem.  The dilemna he faces is that the most qualified people for these positions are not going to be much of an agent for positive change.  And those that would be agents for change quickly become frustrated and will leave.  Kind of a Catch 22 but that is what we get for having spent the last 50 years building up the administrative state.  It won't go away overnight, it won't go away without a fight and it may never go away.

As for Sessions, once he offered to recuse himself in his confirmation hearings Trump should have pulled the nomination and found someone that would not be so encumbered.  I don't think he quite understood what this actually meant when it happened.  On the other hand, that would have left Rosenstein as the acting AG and that also would have been bad.  He should have been fired the day Sessions got there, along with every other Obama appointee.  But that is in hindsight which is usually 20/20 and sometimes 20/10.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/25/2017 6:09:28 PM

Rosenstein is not an Obama appointee. Maybe, Trump just did another lousy job of vetting.?

President Donald Trump nominated Rosenstein to serve as Deputy Attorney General for the United States Department of Justice on January 13, 2017. Rosenstein was confirmed by the U.S. Senate on April 25, 2017.

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/25/2017 9:04:11 PM

I think I read a post from you stating that the State Dept is a kingdom that cannot be ruled.  It is a shame if the bureakraps win and run Tillerson off, but I sure would not blame him.....drain the sewer!

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/26/2017 9:00:34 AM

Rosenstein was a holdover from the Obama administration but was a US Attorney and not Deputy Director of DOJ.  So yes, it does seem that Trump, like every President before him and every President after him, made a bad choice in just not accepting his resignation.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/26/2017 10:19:04 AM

I don't think the problem is at the State Department.  I think the problem is at the WH.  In most Administrations, the Deputy secretaries and the Assistant Secretaries and Bureau Chiefs are put in place pretty quickly.  I don't think Trump realizes that these people are the people that will ensure that his policies are being carried out.  I've actually been pretty impressed with Tillerson for someone with no foreign policy experience.  I think he is a real asset and it would be a shame if he left because Trump kept his hands tied. 

I think at this point the only thing Sessions can do is resign.  When your boss starts bad mouthing you in public and says your job is not secure, it's probably time to think about doing something else.  Maybe there is still time for him to throw his hat in for his old Senate position. 

I confess, I am beginning to lose confidence in Trump.  I really thought he would jump in and straighten things out, get the government moving again.  Cut down on the bureaucracy.  But I don't see that happening. I thought the very reason for bringing in the smart people was to let them do their thing.  The only one he doesn't seem to be messing with is his Defense Secretary. 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	MM.....The Real Story
Date:	7/26/2017 1:06:52 PM

So what?  I said he was an Obama holdover and that's a fact.  He was also on Ken Starr's team when they investigated Slick Willie.  And he was an eagle scout.  And he did well in grade school and had a crush on one of his teachers.  So what?  His decision to appoint a special prosecutor or whatever the heck Mueller is was a mistake and one that the AG should fire him for doing. In a sane world he would have waited until an AG was confirmed, make the recommendation and then let the decision lie with the guy in charge.  Of course Sessions couldn't weigh in on that because of his stupid recusal, right?  So I am back to my original point, Trump should have pulled Sessions nomination the moment he said he would recuse himself in the confirmation hearings.  I hope he resigns soon so we can get an AG that can fully perform his proper functions.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	MM.....The Real Story
Date:	7/26/2017 2:14:42 PM (updated 7/26/2017 2:18:40 PM)

"I hope he resigns soon so we can get an AG that can fully perform his proper functions." Why doesn't your weak President just fire him?  Lindsey Graham has it right...Trump is weak. He can fire big time on a fake tv show but can't act like a man and fire Sessions.

Your party can't lead.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	MM.....The Real Story
Date:	7/26/2017 2:28:18 PM

I could care less what Lindsey Gramnesty says.  He is the last person to talk about having the guts to do something.

I do agree with your latter comment.  Unlike Democrats that have only one driving mantra, the quest for power and control, the GOP actually has fundamental beliefs about the proper role of govt and feel compelled to vote that way.  However, unlike the monolithic Democrats there is actually a difference of opinion in the GOP about that proper role.  Hence the challenge of getting something done because they can't be bought off like Dems to vote for something (recall the Louisiana Purchase and Cornhusker Kickback) like Obamacare.  Having morals, standards of behavior and actually acting on your beliefs is never easy and so the GOP has trouble getting things done.  But voting in lock step is much easier when you have no morals, no standards of behavior and are willing to supplant your beliefs if properly "rewarded", which is the essence of the modern Democrat party.

Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	MM.....The Real Story
Date:	7/26/2017 5:00:02 PM

Again, since GoneFishin accuses me of being your "puppet", I just couldn't let this one slide by. You really "blasted" him as you very succinctly pointed out the "difference" between a Republican and a Democrat.

Name:	lakngulf -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/26/2017 5:40:07 PM

The problems and the systems run deep, and deep pockets will protect the trough as long as it can.  I have said for many years, "Our nation can afford to provide welfare and every need of the poor.  We CANNOT afford white collar welfare"

That was my hope in Trump.  How ironic that it would take a billionaire to run folks from the trough.  Maybe, just maybe it will happen.

I like Tillerson, hope his leave of absence gives him some time to reflect, adjust and come back strong.  Hope Trump will let his operate.  Sessions, i don't know.  But now Sessions is looking into intel leaks.  Please, please, please let's put somebody in jail.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	I don't get
Date:	7/26/2017 9:24:16 PM

this idea you have about "white collar welfare" and frankly, I rather resent you saying it.  Because "welfare" means you are getting something for nothing - and in the 32 years I spent, I felt most years I gave a lot more than I got.  I just think you are so out of touch, because you are judging an entire workforce on the basis of a few interfaces with clerks.  I spent a lot of time in foreign countries negotiating foreign military sales - often to keep the production lines open so the Army could afford to upgrade aging equipment and new technology for our troops.  I can assure you that Kuwait, Saudi and Pakistan were never on my bucket list of fun places to go.  Or when I had an armed guard with me 24/7 and was issued a weapon in El Salvador in the years of their civil war.  Or when I was locked down in my hotel room while I was in Colombia, lest I become a target of opportunity for some drug cartel.  None of those places was on my bucket list.  Or when I spent 4 months in Germany trying to find foreign customers for vehicles that the Army had no funds to repair or ship back to the U.S.  I had a long and varied career - but I sure don't remember getting anything that I didn't earn. 

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/26/2017 9:29:03 PM

Maybe I spoke too soon - Apparently the Pentagon had no prior knowledge that Trump was going to decide that there will be no transgenders in the mililtary.  Understand that Defense has no plan to execute this  - like when the ones already on the books be discharged.  I have never felt comfortable about the transgenders in the military.  It is one thing sitting in an office and quite another being in a remote outpost in Afghanistan in a unit.  The services are still grappling with women in combat units, and gays openly serving in the military.  And understand that Maddox is on vacation. 

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	MM.....The Real Story
Date:	7/26/2017 10:32:19 PM

Goofy just tries to use the left wing's tired playbook of divide and conquer.  Except is doesn't work and that makes him crazy.  So instead of responding to the substance of a post he deflects with personal attacks (someone is a puppet of someone else) or he changes the subject.  A weak mind slavishly devoted to a failed ideology in search of relevance.  Pity the man.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/26/2017 10:38:45 PM

No, it was 45.9% of the voters of the nation including almost all on this forum that made a bad choice!!!

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	I don't get
Date:	7/26/2017 10:54:46 PM

Hound, I generally agree with you and many of the govt employees I have worked with over the years work hard and generally try to do what is right given the dysfunctional system they have to work with.  I think it becomes more personal to many people when they have money taken from them at the point of a gun to pay for govt employees.  If you are mistreated at a business you can take your business elsewhere, not so with government.  You have no choice and no options and I can understand the resentment.

For me what is most disconcerting is that historically the bargain was you worked for the govt for better job security, a little lower pay than the private sector and somewhat better benefits.  That bargain has been turned on its head with large salaries, benefits, pensions, etc., all being paid by taxpayers that make less, have less security and ever decreasing benefits.  People resent that and I can understand why.  That is the way things are in Europe where getting a govt job was like winning the lottery. No job security concerns, better pay, better pensions, better benefits.  But all this comes at a high cost vis-a-vis taxes.  But at some point you run out of other people's money to pay for this ala the pension crises in California, Illinois, etc., etc., etc.

So don't take it personal.  If you worked hard and did as good a job as possible then this comment is not directed at you.  It does apply to far too many govt employees that take advantage of those positions, don't work hard, etc. 

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	AMEN!!!!!!!!!!
Date:	7/27/2017 8:52:27 AM

Good assessment.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	I don't get
Date:	7/27/2017 12:02:51 PM

A lot of us wanted to serve our country.  The government used to have great benefits, a great retirement plan, and generous leave (sick and vacation).  that is no longer the case, as the benefits have eroded (really insurance costs continue to climb, deductibles have gone up, copays have gone up and they use some kind of weird tier system as what prescripion medicines they pay for and to what extent).  The retirement system has been changed and anyone who started work after 1980, is under it, which relies on a much smaller amount from the government, more on social security and whatever you manage to save in your TSP).  As far as I know, they haven't messed with the leave portion - yet. 

On the subject of salaries, it is really hard to compare industry salaries and govenrment salaries.  One thing I will say about that is there has been a big grade creep over a period of time.  I had 3 ladies who worked for me in one job that did nothing more than maintain records of things in and out of our office and they were grossly overpaid (and of course, they all thought they should have been promoted and paid more).  I also had about 6 more clerical contract support than I needed and I cut that down right away).  In addition to the grade creep, there is a lessening of authority given to those at the top of the pay scale (I'm talking career staff and not politicals) and if Congress had their way, everything would be decided at the Secretariat level).  And I do think that should be reduced and more authority pushed downward.  I have to say, I didn't feel underpaid or overpaid.  In DOD, with each increase in military spending, came a push to upgrade positions.  Then they started "pay banding" to do away with grades and steps, but all that meant at the end of the day, was that salairies were no longer subjected to the mandatory wait times between increases.  It was great if you were a top perfomer and got to the top of your pay band really quickly. (pay banding was like salary range on the outside). 

I would be the first person to tell you there is duplication of effort in DOD.  There was one office of 4 people, headed by a senior executive, whose sole mission was to produce a report that no one used - in fact they didn't even compile it but paid an outside company to do the work.  It was about a million a year.  One of my bosses tried to get that office disbanded, but do you think she could? No.  Reason? They didn't want to lose the budget line and the senior executive position that went with it.  And then there are the White House Fellows.  They come out of graduate school, get a promotion every year, and finally, they enter the executive service.  Now, mind you, they aren't assigned a job that supports the "executive" status, and in some cases they do the same job they were doing as a lessor grade.  But that is the system. (and BTW, that one cuts across Departments and is govenrment wide).  I mean, why should someone be a Senior Executive, unless they are in charge of something? 

I could write pages and pages of the ways govenment could actually do away with duplication and consolidate missions, just with my limited knowledge and it would save the govenrment millions of dollars.  Nothing like being on the inside to know where to look for the skelatons. but the "rice bowl" issues make change damn near impossible. 

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Tillerson and Sessions leaving?
Date:	7/27/2017 12:06:30 PM

And the plot thickens -  Apparently the ban on transgenders wa ssomething traded for votes for Trumps wall budget.  And it was reported this morning that his tweets were not intended as a change in policy.  Huh?  Maybe we were better off when negotiations were done in smokey back rooms.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	I don't get
Date:	7/27/2017 1:30:52 PM

I can't comment on DOD but I can about EPA and state environmental agencies.  EPA pays very well and their benefits are likewise very good when compared to my industry.  It used to be that people would put some time in at the agency and then go to consulting or industry for a big pay bump and less rich benefits plan.  Not so much these days as the pay differential is negligible and the benefits are still better than we can offer.  State agencies are a mixed bag, some comparable to EPA and some less.

Name:	lakngulf -	Reply
Subject:	I don't get
Date:	7/27/2017 6:38:37 PM

Sorry, I have been away from my laptop.  That looked like a drive by shooting.

My concept of WCW is not a something for nothing, by all means it is a quid pro quo.  And I am not so concerned with employees (although you made a great case for overall reform of many employee setups below).  And I may be way off base, but I think there are so many Deep State folks who get their pockets lined when they can get certain policy matters pushed thru, or gain some access  to some movers and shakers.  I think that is why the Dems and many, many GOPs are so against Trump.  He does not want to keep the gravy train going.

It is just my opinion, but I have seen reports of how rich some of these Ol Country Boys, or maxine waters become after a few dozen years in D.C.  Influence is for sale!