Forum Thread
(Hopeville Pond Specific)
0 messages
Updated
Lakes Online Forum
84,091 messages
Updated 11/8/2024 10:28:12 AM
Lakes Online Forum
5,204 messages
Updated 9/14/2024 10:10:50 AM
(Hopeville Pond Specific)
0 messages
Updated
Lakes Online Forum
4,172 messages
Updated 9/9/2024 5:04:44 PM
Lakes Online Forum
4,262 messages
Updated 11/6/2024 6:43:09 PM
Lakes Online Forum
2,979 messages
Updated 6/26/2024 5:03:03 AM
Lakes Online Forum
98 messages
Updated 4/15/2024 1:00:58 AM
Hopeville Pond Photo Gallery





    
Name:   Shortbus - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 8:45:31 AM (updated 3/16/2016 8:49:16 AM)

Soros Floods Democrats With Millions, Warns Trump Of

 

http://www.infowars.com/soros-floods-democrats-with-millions-warns-trump-of-consequences/

 

 

WHAT ALL AMERICANS NEED TO KNOW ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON’S ALLEGED SAP COMPROMISE--MAJ ED COET, USA (RET)

[COURTESY: CAPT Les Horn, USN (Ret)]

My name is Ed Coet. I am a retired US Army Intelligence Officer. In my last job in the army I was the Chief of the Human Intelligence Branch for the US European Command in Stuttgart, Germany. In that capacity I was also the Designated Program Manager for a Special Access Program (SAP) like the SAP that Hillary Clinton is alleged to have compromised in the most recent State Department Inspector General report to congress and which has been widely reported in the news. Here is what I personally know about SAP’s and what I can attest to in an unclassified forum:

1. The names of each SAP are themselves classified Top Secret because the information within the SAP are far and above Top Secret.

2. SAP’s are so sensitive that even people who have security clearances giving them access to Top Secret Sensitive Compartment Information (TS SCI), an enormously high security clearance level, cannot have accesses to a SAP’s unless they receive a special indoctrination into the SAP based on an operational “must know” that exceeds all other “need to know” standards.

3. Being “read on” for a SAP is far more then acknowledging in writing that you have been briefed on the SAP. It is an in-depth “indoctrination” into the given SAP, and each SAP is itself compartmented separately from other SAPS. Having access to one SAP does not give you access to another SAP, and in fact rarely does. Only a tiny handful of people have knowledge of all SAP’s. SAP’s are the most stringently compartmented and protected information in the entire US government.

4. Unlike Top Secret SCI which is maintained in highly secure Sensitive Compartmented Information Facilitates (SCIF’s) managed by specially trained Special Security Officers (SSO’s) at various levels of command, every single SAP is managed by an individually designated Program Manager for each individual SAP covering an entire theater of operations. In other words, SAP Program Managers are far fewer in number than there is SSO’s. SSO’s are not cleared to even know about SAP’s or to maintain information about them in their already enormously secure SCIF’s. How SAP’s are secured cannot be discussed because of the sensitive beyond Top Secret nature in which it is done.

5. Unlike individuals with the highest Top Secret SCI access security clearances, who must undergo a special background information with periodic “bring-up” background investigation, those tiny few who have access to SAP’s must also endure periodic polygraph tests in addition to the most comprehensive of special background investigations. I used to have to schedule four-star generals and admirals to be polygraphed in order for them to maintain their access to my SAP. Many generals and admirals who obviously have the highest security clearances still did not rate being indoctrinated into my SAP. In fact, they didn’t even know the SAP existed.

6. Compromise of a SAP is the single most dangerous security violation that can ever happen to the USA. Even the enormously damaging revelations of the Edward Snowden’s TOP Secret SCI security compromise does not reach the level of a SAP compromise.

7. To put SAP information in to an unsecure sever like Hillary Clinton’s unsecure server is a class one felony that could, in some cases, result in life in prison. That is because such a compromise is so dangerous that it could and likely will result in the death of people protected by and within the scope of the SAP.

As a former SAP Program Manager I believe it is inconceivable that if it is verified that Hillary Clinton’s server actually had SAP information on it that she could possibly escape indictment and criminal prosecution. As hard as it is to imagine, that would even be worse then electing to not prosecute a mass murdering serial killer because even they could not inflict as much damage on our country as the compromise of a SAP. Compromise of a SAP not only could -- but without doubt would -- cause serious damage to our national security.

If it is true that Hillary Clinton had SAP information on her unsecure server, whether it was marked or not, you can be sure that the FBI will strongly recommend that charges be brought against Hillary Clinton and continue in an exhaustive investigation to trace back to every single person that had even the tiniest role in this unbelievable security compromise.

If the Attorney General, through “prosecutorial discretion,” elected not to prosecute this crime, I believe congress would have no alternative but to impeach her, and the FBI would then have no choice but to conduct a criminal investigation of her for a deliberate cover up –- so grave is this security violation.

If President Obama were to pardon Hillary Clinton for a compromise of this magnitude he would render himself in the historical record as an “enemy of the state,” and could himself face criminal prosecution –- so grave is such a security compromise. Nobody, not even the POTUS could gets away with something like this in our system of government. If anyone could escape persecution for compromising a SAP, we are deep trouble as a nation. No president who loves this country and is true to his oath would ever allow anyone, not even his or her closest and most loved relative, to get away with a SAP compromise. It is simply unimaginable that this could ever happen.

If the ongoing investigation finds that Hillary Clinton compromised a SAP, then we all should know with certainty, regardless of political persuasion, that she is entirely unfit to hold public office of any kind let alone President of the USA -- and ALL Americans should never tolerate it. Compromising a SAP is an absolute “disqualifier” for public office and access to our nations most sensitive information - period.

ED COET

Major, US Army (Retired)





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 11:00:02 AM

I'm not sure this gentleman hasn't violated the law even with the information he has provided.

I have seen no  clear information that Hilary even had any kind of classified information on her server.  I've heard on the news that some of the documents were improperly marked but there is often discussion even among intelligence professionals whether something is properly marked or not. If it is taken from a correctly classified source document then it is easy, but if it has been paraphased and not quoted, it gets tricky.   And if it is just a case of For Official Use Only - that isn't even a classification but only a warning that some of the information might be sensitive. 

Sorry, but I just don't think anything is going to come of this.  In some ways, I think it is just a bit of political theatre.  And I don't think it is in the same category as Patreus (who got off so easily and should have, IMHO, been reduced in rank) or Snowden (who I believe committed treason). 





Name:   MartiniMan - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 11:27:29 AM

I agree with you that this is probably not going anywhere but you have to be kidding about the lack of classified information on her server, right?  The IG and State have already identified over 1,000 emails on her server that were classified, some of which contained SAP and were too sensitive to be released even in redacted form.  It is not even remotely arguable about the presence of classified information on her server and her only defense is that it wasn't marked classified, which is complete hooey.  I have zero doubt she violated the law and the fact that 150 FBI agents are working on this is pretty telling, not to mention the granting of immunity.  The next step is to interview her underlings who will either be forced to rat her out or perjure themselves.

But at the end of the day DOJ is the only one that can indict and while the FBI may make an ironclad argument for indictment, I seriously doubt that DOJ will follow through.  We will then see how much integrity Comey has and how he responds.  If no indictment I would expect a slew of leaks of the evidence to the press.  Whether that has political implications is anyone's guess but I am not optimistic.





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 12:11:27 PM

Obviously, you have seen some articles I haven't seen.  I don't follow it closely, because I feel DOJ will not agree to prosecute her.  At the least, she'll probably be fined and then only after the election. 





Name:   MrHodja - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 12:26:29 PM

If the news articles are anywhere close to factual, I have to agree with MM.  If what the Major said about SAP is true, and if the refusal to release some emails in any form is really due to their content being SAP or SAP-related, she needs to be prosecuted.  As the senior executive of a major governmental department IT WAS HER RESPONSIBILITY to ensure classified information was properly protected.

 

Hound, the only channel reporting all this with any regularity is Fox, and there is plenty to report.  The mainstream media is complicit in hiding the information from the voting public.





Name:   MartiniMan - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 12:41:09 PM

Here's just one of hundreds but I will clarify this is the NY Times so it may be wrong.  But they are clearly not right wingers.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/30/us/politics/22-clinton-emails-deemed-too-classified-to-be-made-public.html?_r=0





Name:   Shortbus - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 3:14:10 PM

http://www.americanpatriotdaily.com/latest/the-nail-in-the-coffin-for-hillary-shes-done/

 





Name:   MartiniMan - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 3:48:45 PM

That's all very interesting but if DOJ declines to indict it goes nowhere from a criminal standpoint.  Then it will be left to the voters to decide whether this is important.......you know, the same voters that returned Obama to the WH after four miserable years.  I am not optimistic on either front.....sadly....





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 5:29:42 PM

Things that could be too classifid to release may only be Confidential,  secret or TS, any of which could case some level of harm to U.S. national security.    I believe what the retired Army manager said is true, but I believe he committed a security violation even saying what he said.  Which is why I don't want to talk about this any more. 

I believe that I have read that there was classified info on her server, but I also thought I read that it wasn't marked as such and only upon further review did they determine it was such.  And yes, Hodja is right, she was responsible to ascetain that she was not getting classified information on her server.  The telling thing is that apparently there was an email exchange where she told her staff to take off the markings and send it to her.  Clearly, she did things she should not have done.  I guess none of this shocks me because I have heard people over the years play fast and loose with classified information.  I even had an SES boss when I was on the Army Staff, go out in a public forum and discuss a classified program.  Defense News happened to be there and reported what he said and he was given the option to be fired or to quit, but he prosecuted or fined and he was no where close to the statue of a Secretary of State. 

From a political perspective, the WH is not going to let the DOJ prosecute her, because she is really their only hope for the election.  And if they didn't allow her to run, who coud they put in?

 





Name:   MartiniMan - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 5:36:47 PM

It would be a real problem for them as no one (Biden, Warren, Kerry, etc.) has the ground game and would be off to a late start at best.  I suppose they could turn to Bernie but they know he would be smoked in the general.  No doubt Obama doesn't want his legacy, such as it is, unwound by a Republican president.  What will be interesting is if the polls switch around and it looks like Hillary would lose anyway.  Then they might sacrifice her under threat of indictment to back out.  All not likely to happen.  It's a sad day that someone like Hillary could have clearly violated the law, jeopardized national security and run a pay for play scheme out of SOS and get away with it all, all for Obama's political gain.





Name:   Lifer - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 8:25:12 PM

Unbelievable. You claim this SAP manager might have violated the law just by speaking in such generic terms but take every opportunity to defend and deflect criticisms of Hillary. How we can be this deep into this scandal and have not seen/heard anything to convince you she had classified material on the server is beyond me. Even the state dept. has confirmed she did. Anybody with connected brain cells knew the first time she held a presser that she was lying. There is no way in hell she could hold that office for 4 years and never send or receive classified material. Strange too that this morning you denied it but come back this afternoon knowing about her instructing her minions to strip the markings and fax it. As SoS basically every thing she said was classified. Try checking out Drudge Report sometime. You demand me of Obama and his claims that he always learns of scandals the same time we do, in the news reports.





Name:   lucky67 - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 8:40:19 PM

at this time--"what does it matter "???





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 9:45:32 PM

I never said that she didn't send or receive classified data during her 4 year appointment.  I know she worked out of her office a lot, so I don't think this is a problem.  We are talking about electronic transmissions of classified data.  It would not have been out of the question for her to have a classified server to receive and send classified, and it would not be out of the question for her to have it at her house, if she had a room that met security specifications.  Yes, this does happen in DC among high level officials.  I have known people that had secure lines in their house.  The government gets to inspect it and approve it.  They also can have a safe in their house, that is inspected and approved by security officials to keep classified data in. 

But I am concluding from what is being said is that her server was not classified.  As I have said, I have not paid a great deal of attention to this, because I'm 95% certain that this investigation will not result in her being charged or prosecuted.  As I say, I predict that if anything comes of this, she might be fined, but it will be after the election.  And I believe this because the Democrats don't have anyone else to run.  And I am not defending Hilary or saying she didn't do anything wrong.  I'm not going to vote for her

Yes, I agree that if she knowingly had classified data on her server, or if she told her staff to remove the marking on a classified document in order to send it to her in an unclassified environment, she should be prosecuted - however, the FBI will have to make a case how national security was, in fact, harmed by her actions.  And that can be very hard to prove.  I wish this stuff was all as cut and dried as you all seem to think.  And if Fox News is leading you to conclude that, well shame on them.  That is likely why it the investigation is taking so long. 

 And yes, I believe the well meaning retired Officer may have inadvertently committed a security violation because what he is discussing is classified and even the existnce of such things is classifed and never publicly acknowledged..  And even if the press talks about it, doesn't mean it isn't classified. 





Name:   MrHodja - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/16/2016 10:33:37 PM

I don't think the Major revealed any classified information.  His responsibility didn't end with his debrief and as an Intel officer he should know ... unless he is using a pseudonym to avoid prosecution.... but the existence of SAP was kicked around a lot when I was on active duty but there was no attempt to hide its existence, just the program name and contents.





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/17/2016 9:40:45 AM

I was told that  the existence of these programs is classified and never publicly acknowledged.   Perhaps I was misinformed.  And his experience may be much more current than mine.  I will be retired 10 years in September. 

Are you still in Panama?  Or have you moved on?

 





Name:   MrHodja - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/17/2016 12:11:46 PM (updated 3/17/2016 12:18:29 PM)

Came back last day of Feb.  Their version of TSA is hyper about anything in your carry ons.  Took stuff from me I had been carrying on board in the US and back and forth to Italy, France, Spain and Portugal for probably 20 years.  After we passed through the security line (and TSA Pre-Check doesn't mean squat to them) my wife bought a plastic bottle of water....but there was another security screening at the gate and they took away the bottle of water she bought INSIDE THE SECURITY PERIMETER!

 

I will say two things regarding classification and protecting classified information.  First, the Governemnt IN GENERAL grossly over classifies information, and second, there are many individuals in Government who play fast and loose with rules for handling classified information.

 

When I was handling the secure voice communications program for the Air Force, we had a small section across the hall that nobody seemed to know what they did.  All I knew was when they said they needed something it became the AF's number one priority.  Only one outside of their group was briefed in their operation, and when they asked for something I simply asked him if it was a real requirement and if he said yes, it bypassed all other requirements.  While I could roughly estimate what I thought they might be doing by piecing together bits of information...locations, aircraft, and such I never knew for sure and don't until this day know what they were doing.  I do know that one day an Army 0-6 who hitched a ride in our car pool spit out what I assumed to be the name of the program, based on what he was talking about and the reaction of another in the car.  Also, in an open meeting one time an NSA rep casually used the top secret code word in open conversation.  I wasn't briefed at that point in time so didn't know if maybe it had been declassified, especially since Henry Kissinger was photographed at some international meeting thumbing through a folder with the TS code word written on the outside cover in bold letters.  I found out later it had not been declassified.





Name:   Talullahhound - Email Member
Subject:   SAP's .......... from a former SAP manager
Date:   3/17/2016 5:31:20 PM

I agree that the government does over classify, and two of the reasons is to protect it from the media and also protect it from FOIAs.  I just read a scalding article in the Washington Post about how the FOIA system is worthless because everything is either given the slow roll or dedacted to point of being worthless. 

We had a guy in our organization who fought with a couple of past Directors and was a persona non grata (in our organization).  I know of things that got classified just so we could take action against him when he leaked stuff to the media. 

The only things that should really be classified are those things that would truly affect national security or things that divulge sources and means. 

Just all this talking about classified is giving me a headache.  So glad that has no place in my life now.









Quick Links
Hopeville Pond News
Hopeville Pond Photos
Hopeville Pond Videos




About Us
Contact Us
Site Map
Search Site
Advertise With Us
   
HopevillePond.LakesOnline.com
THE HOPEVILLE POND WEBSITE

Copyright 2024, Lakes Online
Privacy    |    Legal