| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 8:01:04 AM (updated 5/31/2013 8:07:31 AM)
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I guess the Rethuglicans are celebrating.
A young Salvadorian woman is pregnant with a fetus that has developed completely without a brain and has only a slight chance of surviving in any state outside the womb and has absolutely no chance at all of surviving as anything other than a completely unaware, unfeeling, and helpless vegetable being kept "alive" by a feeding tube. The woman has a severe heart disorder and her doctor has told her that she will likely die if she carries the baby to term. The laws of El Salvador prohibit abortion for any reason and the Supreme Court of the nation has told the woman she cannot have an abortion. They in effect have condemned her to death by birthing a vegetable baby without a brain!
This is way beyond Terry Schiavo!
Any comments reasonable or otherwise?
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 8:19:54 AM
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Everybody dies.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 8:22:57 AM
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Brilliant!!
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 8:36:17 AM
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I detect sarcasm.
Are you just now aware of this reality, or are you scared of dying?
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| Name: |
h_hob
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 8:36:29 AM
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Just like a liberal, the real scandal having an impact on our nation is omama. So the liberal has to find one person outside the U.S. to try and deflect our attention to it. Liberals can't see the forest for the trees.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
No
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Date:
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5/31/2013 9:51:06 AM
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It appears to me that the Salvadoran Supreme Court upheld Salvadoran law. No abortions, no exceptions. To do otherwise would have been judicial activism. So where is the scandal? And why do you try to bring in American Republicans? Is that the best you can muster up to support your pathetic Republican-hating agenda?
No, Archibald, the real scandal that we all should be concerned bout is the way the current administration has misused its power strictly for political gain. Despicable behavior.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
So the others are not real?
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Date:
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5/31/2013 10:57:33 AM
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And to think you claimed you would wait until all the evidence is in before weighing in......what a hypocrite as we know full well if it were a Republican you would be posting constantly on the forum and not waiting for any evidence. But of course, since it is your demi-god in the WH you call the scandals fake. Heck, even the govt media acknowledges most of the scandals are real.....well, all except pmsnBS, which explains why their ratings are in the toilet even further than before these hit and they went into full coverup mode......but wait, they did post pictures of SOTUS' prom picture and gave us wall to wall on Branjolinas breasts and ovaries, that Arias murderer and the Cleveland perverts. No wonder SNL made fun of the media on this one with one of their skits....
Don't bother driving by unless you have something meaningful to add...
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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5/31/2013 6:18:37 PM (updated 5/31/2013 6:22:45 PM)
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I drive by because I am concerned with this issue.
You people are sick...anybody who has no problem with condemning a woman (a woman by the way, who already has a young healthy son to raise) to death in order to force the "birth" of a blob of tissue which itself will be dead on arrival or shortly after...well, you are sick.
As an update, a more compassionate Minister of Health has intervened and instructed that she will "deliver" the fetus early through cesarean section. The "baby" will be "born" early and will be born dead or will die, but no "abortion" has occurred. It is shameful when political ideology and religious dogma trumps common sense and compassion. It is ridiculous when semantic trickery must be used to overcome stupidity. I bring the Republicans into it because they never fail to demonstrate they come down on the side of ideology and "principle" rather than reason and compassion.
Now MM, if you don't consider this a "meaningful" issue worthy of consideration, you are the sickest of them all...I am disgusted and angry almost to the point of throwing up at the callous responses seen above. Good God, do none of you have any concern with the well being of human beings in general and women in particular? I know I disgust you bunch of buffoons, but not anywhere near the degree of complete revulsion in which I now hold all of you!!!
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| Name: |
h_hob
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| Subject: |
So the others are not real?
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Date:
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6/1/2013 1:32:45 PM
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This is a case of GFY is riding the short bus and Archiebelle has graduated to driving it.
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
A REAL scandal!
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Date:
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6/1/2013 4:56:25 PM
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So, now that you are the one who decides who should live, and who should die:
What about my grandma on dialysis?
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 8:38:47 AM
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Your Grandma, like this Salvadorian woman, is a born and living human being...not a blob of tissue with no brain! You can make a reasonable argument from several directions against aborting a healthy fetus (call it a baby if that makes you feel better) whose birth will not cause physical or mental harm to the woman...you can not make a reasonable argument against ending the pregnancy of the woman in question. Use a little common sense for once...please for the love of God!
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 9:05:27 AM
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The crux is this: is the concept of "sanctity of life" an absolute, or just discretionary?
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| Name: |
h_hob
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 9:30:14 AM
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I can't believe someone like you, invoking the name of God. Scuttle back to your hole, weasel.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 2:28:38 PM (updated 6/2/2013 2:42:45 PM)
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It depends on how you define life...I do not consider a brainless blob "life"...I do consider the woman who carries it in her womb as "life". So do you put the "life" of the blob above the "life" of a woman? Should she be required to put her "life" at great risk in order to give (perhaps) a few seconds of lifeless "life" to the blob? Really...think hard about this then please answer my question.
I find the callous reaction to this by all the comments so far scary as he//. There is ideology, there in principle and there is common sense and humanity. This is a case where it is hard for me to believe anybody would have ideology and principle trump common sense and human compassion in a case such as this. "There is nothing more frightening than a man who is absolutely certain he is right all the time." Don't remember who said it, but he was a genius.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 2:35:29 PM
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A friend of mine who recently retired from years of working for various children's social services pretty well sums it up..."It is amazing how so many of the right wingers believe the government's concern with a child's life should begin at conception and end at birth."
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
Now there is a questionable question
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Date:
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6/2/2013 5:53:43 PM
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Guess what? I knew how you would answer the questionable question, that you could not answer in less than 125 words, and that none of those words would give a direct response to what seemed like a yes or no question. I did not ask what the definition of the word "is" is, although that appears to be a routine maneuver of liberals under questioning. Are you actually architect Esq., JD, QC?
The fact that you portray yourself in this setting as totally aghast and unbelieving of the "callous" remarks is laughable. You forget that you totally discounted any other "common sense and humanity" even as you may made your assertions.
I actually heard the quote as this - " Sometimes wrong, but never in doubt" in reference to General Douglas MaArthur (and I am sure this applies to many others)
And one last thing: I think most right wingers are more concerned with the birth and the death, and would prefer the government stay out of everything in between...............
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
OK...here's my yes or no
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Date:
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6/2/2013 9:45:39 PM (updated 6/2/2013 9:59:57 PM)
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Yes, the sanctity OF HUMAN LIFE is absolute (you do eat meat don't you?). A fetus which can not yet survive outside the womb is not yet life. A blob with no brain will never be life. Also remember...there are exceptions to every rule. It is quite instructive that you have no problem with government intrusion before birth and near death but abhor it in between.
Of course it is no surprise that in your 168 words you did not answer my "yes or no" question. Do you believe the "sanctity life" means the life of an unborn fetus without a brain is more sanctified than the life of the woman who carries it? Do you consider them equal? Do you think she should birth the blob even if it means her death? You demand a yes or no from me. Should I expect less from you? That's an additional question for you BTW.
I can assure you the quote I gave was not from or in reference to McArthur. The quote you reference does not even have anything close to the same meaning.
I am Architect, AIA...B-arch Ga Tech 1967....I'm sure you are a Harvard MBA, PHD, JD, DD! Heck you might even outrank MM.
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
OK oh omnipitent one
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Date:
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6/2/2013 10:19:47 PM
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That you pose as the arbiter of life and death is the most disturbing (horrifying) part of this - another reflection of the arrogance of the human condition I suppose. I am sorry I didn't answer your question, I was so crushed that you didn't answer mine that I suppose I overlooked it.
Here is my answer: the sanctity of life implies that one life is no more valuable than any other. Now that we know you are able to make value judgements like this, we can easily solve the money and resource problems of our society - just point out the drains on humanity and we will have the executioner perform his duty. You can be the presiding officer of the Gosnell Ministry of Humanism, and lead us into your brave new world!! The young and the old produce nothing and consume much, and I am sure you can come up with a very convincing decision tree to survival (all we've got now is you, and although I'm sure you know pornography, and life, when you see it, the rest of us don't know how to define it.)
m sorry, but as far as the quote thing goes, you would have missed that one on the logic test....
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Right On Comrade
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Date:
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6/2/2013 11:31:46 PM
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"And one last thing: I think most right wingers are more concerned with the birth and the death, and would prefer the government stay out of everything in between..............." Until there is a tornado, hurricane, flood, earthquake, fire....then the right complains with the left.....why is the government so slow with relief. Government is good when it helps me....the greedy right is no different. You need to be honest to be taken serious. And that is an absolute fact.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
[Message deleted by author]
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Date:
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6/3/2013 8:24:05 AM (updated 6/3/2013 8:24:49 AM)
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
OK oh omnipitent one
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Date:
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6/3/2013 8:24:08 AM
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Comradical, simply living human life is a series of value judgments, conscious or unconscious, on a daily basis. If you are not aware of that you must be a robot. Seem to be lots of robots about in the land today, especially in the GOP. There is an exception to prove every rule...thinking people realize this..."sheeple" do not. In some cases, as with this woman, a display of common sense and compassion is the exception! Sad the robots are unable know it.
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
OK oh omnipitent one
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Date:
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6/3/2013 8:38:30 AM
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Then your answer that the sanctity of human life is an absolute, was a lie.......can you see that?
At that point, what makes your value judgement any better than GF's or mine?
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
OK oh omnipitent one
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Date:
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6/3/2013 9:11:10 AM (updated 6/3/2013 9:17:07 AM)
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Good grief. You have the gall to ask what makes my value judgment better than yours! Well...what makes your value judgment better than mine? NOTHING...they are both opinions...nothing more and nothing less.
My answer was not a lie. Can't you see that a reasonable person cannot answer such a question UNTIL the word "life" is defined by each individual being asked the question (something you have yet to do BTW). A cow is alive before sent to the slaughter house...you are not a peta member and vegan are you...do you eat meat? I gave you MY definition. We are talking HUMAN life. A brainless blob of tissue is not human life by my definition any more than a cancer cell. Now you may have a different definition and that is fine, so what "arbiter" do you propose to decide which is the correct definition to always be enforced without exception. Just typing these words make me shudder
Now, you still have not given a direct yes or no answer to any of my questions. The most important being...should this woman be forced to bear whatever is in her womb (even if it is a healthy fetus for that matter) even if it means she will or might die by doing so? Yes or no! Answer the dam# question!!
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
OK oh omnipitent one
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Date:
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6/3/2013 9:35:15 AM
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She should be forced to follow the law if she wants to employ the benefits of her medical system. Otherwise, she is free to pursue any solution to her problem she can afford, and she can accept all consequences of her decision.
I don't have a problem with it either way, I just find it amusing how agitated you get in trying to tell everyone else how to live and think.
You started the whole discussion with an argument that your judgement was the correct one, and the horror that registered when there was any other choice to be made.
The definition of life is pretty simple if defined scientifically. If you choose some other framework, you have to deal with increasing levels of uncertainty.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Oh my...a lecture from the likes of you
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Date:
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6/3/2013 1:26:34 PM
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Archie, I have to give you credit for your chutzpah. You, a pro-abortion fanatic lecturing me on the sanctity of life. Here's the difference between you and I Archie and it is fundamental. I believe and trust in God's will over man's will any day. Save your faux outrage for the millions of babies that have been murdered since Roe v. Wade......oh wait a second, you and Margaret Sanger like it when those black and hispanic babies get aborted......very eugenics of you.
As for me, there is little to nothing I can do about the laws in another country thatwere upheld by their Supreme Court. If you want to do something why not move there, get citizenship and vote for pro-abortion candidates and liberal activist judges? But I suppose the only time you like their decisions is when they come up with a phony right to privacy to allow the murder of babies but not when they uphold the laws passed by the government in some latin american country......now you know how we feel about Roe v Wade. How does it feel? Oh wait a second, you are allowed to be outraged because they voted against your beliefs but we should admonished for ours.....I forget that left wing nuts always want to have their cake and eat it too.
That the only so-called scandal you can find is an event in some latin American country pretty much sums you up. You said you were waiting for the evidence but have now proclaimed all the many SOTUS scandals as not being real. Would love to see your evidence that none of these scandals are real, or did lie or are you maybe just a hypocrite? Which is it?
And spare me the lecture on the sanctity of life....you have zero moral standing on that issue with me.......
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
WOW
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Date:
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6/3/2013 7:00:47 PM
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Your posts says it all!!! I sure hope you never have a daughter or grand daughter having to face the same situation and be forced to die for the sake of the law and a blob of tissue.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
MY MY
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Date:
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6/3/2013 7:08:31 PM
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You can always count on MM's extremist rants to weaken his case. I also hope, no I pray, you never have a daughter or grand daughter face a similar horror. Will you look her in the eye and say "tough...it's the law and God's will."? That's a question MM but I know enough about you to expect another rant and change of subject rather than an answer.
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
MY MY
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Date:
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6/3/2013 7:43:40 PM
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How do you feel about Down's children? Blob or no blob?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Won't have to
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Date:
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6/3/2013 10:36:17 PM
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They too have a strong faith and unlike weak, pathetic leftists they will carry the cross God gives them. You see Archie, there is no virtue in lying about life to young people. It is why millennials are such a mess.
Don't bother me with your leftist tripe about what if it is your daughter......such a pathetic and meaningless statement. What if your parents had aborted you instead of having the courage and generosity to have you? Same line of nonsense. And by the way, it is not extremist to be authentically Christian, except maybe in the circles you run in. I believe in the sanctity of life from conception to natural death. And I will always trust Gods will over any man, especially godless atheists who love abortion so much that they can fake outrage to avoid dealing with the scandals, incompetence and failures of their false god........where's the gold calf when you need it?
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