| Name: |
RvrRatt
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 9:33:19 AM
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For the most part, I lurk on this blog only occasionally commenting. When I do comment, it has usually been concerning the lake level.
I have been a lake property owner for around 7 or 8 years. Rarely during that time has the lake level been maintained at full pool for any length of time. Such is the nature of a reservoir as opposed to a lake.
I truly believe the lake is being mismanaged and having a background in engineering, I have come to this conclusion over 7 years of observation and data gathering. The mismanagement is not just APCO’s fault but the Corp of engineers as well as other government entities involved. And for certain the droughts, which no one has any control over and which are/have been very real and very severe, have only made the problem worse.
I have reached a conclusion that the only way for us as property owners to ever see any lasting change is to go the so called “green” or “tree hugger” route. The same route taken by the paddle boat people south of us. The LMLPA plus the business owners plus the property owners must do enough research to find a legitimate “green” or environmental reason to maintain higher lake levels. This seems to be the only thing the government entities in control listen to. Water quality, fish habitat (I saw someone comment on this earlier concerning cropy spawning) shell fish habitat, water flow (see the stagnant comment on the kayak groups web site) endangered species etc. etc. etc. A good verifiable reason is there we simply have to find it and then do the research to back it up. This is exactly what the kayak folks used to gain increased water flows at our expense. Find a rare bug, fish, mussle, bird, weed, whatever and prove that the constantly changing water levels are having a detrimental effect and viola! You have the answer to our problem!
If your opponent is beating you and beating you consistently, perhaps you should find out what it is he is beating you with and adopt his tactics.
My two cents worth
RiverRatt
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| Name: |
MovinFr8
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 10:24:24 AM
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I will be involved in any effort that is taken because we are not going anywhere and want the best for everything involved with this lake.
Count me in
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| Name: |
hookdoc
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 10:58:23 AM
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Somebody finally hit the nail on the head. This is what I have thought all along. Any fisherman will tell you that the constant variance is disturbing fish bedding, shad reproduction etc. The environmental approach is if not the total answer along with the other work being done should be productive and thanks to everyone working so hard on this issue.
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| Name: |
twc
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 11:47:26 AM
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I don't diagree. But how about this for outside the box?
The "green" we are missing is revenue. The fluctuating and inconsistant lake levels are costing the area money. Big fishing tournaments are passing us up for lakes with more predictable levels. Recreational boaters are passing us up for lakes with more water. The marinas are losing fuel sales. The area restaurants are losing business. The rental housing are missing customers because people can't count on the lake being full.
Someone mentioned earlier that we need to get the elected officials involved. They are the ones that would be most concerned about tax revenues.
And heres another green idea for you. If they would hold the lake level up longer and bring it up sooner. They could use that water to generate electricity in the warmer months thereby, reducing the greenhouse gasses from the coal fired plant downstream. More hydro, less coal.
I've got more but this whole thing gets my blood pressure up. Gimme a few.
<><
TC
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| Name: |
RvrRatt
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 1:40:45 PM
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I certainly dont disagree with TC as cash will always gain you some attention and it will absolutely take a combined effort. But, from a government perspective, we are dealing with mainly federal level entities. They dont give a rats rear end about local cash flow. If some marina, eatery, boat dealer etc. goes under, or if we tramp around all year in the mud it doesnt register on their radar screens. However, find a damn snail darter or some kind of rare mussel or a stagnant pool of water or a wet land that is drying up and they will be all over it. Plus you will get more help than you need OR WANT from the other so called "green" groups trying to justify their federal grants or their existance.
Get the environmental people on our side, especially in the current political environment, and eventually we will make some progress.
Two more cents worth
RiverRatt
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| Name: |
ALLSOUTH1
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 1:59:11 PM (updated 5/15/2012 2:00:48 PM)
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Riverrat is dead on. We've got to get some green group to help us. They all receive federal grants and monies.
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| Name: |
twc
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 2:02:23 PM
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Ok, so where do we find such people? I don't hang out with many liberal tree hugging types. Maybe they're becoming extinct too?
Where's a hippie when you need one?
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| Name: |
RvrRatt
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 3:00:01 PM
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I assure you, I am about as far from being a left winger as one can get! Being a keen observer people and issues in general, I see where this whole environmental issue has worked all over the country. Just ask someone who cant use their land because it has a so called "wet land" area on it! If you cant beat um, join um! At least long enough to get what you want!
Find the issue, start yelling about it and they (the greenies) will find you. This will not be a quick fix. Research will have to be done and an effort would have to be officially launched. Say for instance, I am just throwing out a hypothetical, the LMLPA gets a big boost in membership. That membership, who would have to be willing to put their money where their mouth is, would have to loudly voice their concerns about...say for instance, the fish spawning problem mentioned earlier. The LMLPA would then have to pay someone to do the research to accurately record the problem and its effect on the environment. Then you publicize the info and go to the feds (FERC etc.)It doesnt have to be the LMLPA, it could be any organization, Hell form a new organization, "The Concerned Fishermen of Logan Martin Lake", "The Friends of the Full Pool", whatever. It will take money, it will take organization, it will take time, it will take dedication but it can be done. Just look at what a bunch of kayakers were able to pull off down stream.
That makes about 6 cents so I will go back to lurking!
Riverratt
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| Name: |
jace
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 6:31:00 PM
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Ive been on this lake on and off from 1969. I have been vocal on this for years I think all of you are correct, but like Gen Patton said hit them on all sides. We need to get people working on all these ideas. Where do we go from here?
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| Name: |
Chris
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 7:10:31 PM
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I have not been a fan of LMLPA in the past for many reasons, but I now think they are the vehicle needed for change. LMLPA is growing and is becoming stronger day by day. LMLPA made some good progress last year in getting better leadership - more needs to be done. We need to show ourselves in large numbers and make it known that we demand LMLPA make LONG TERM solutions to water levels the number one priority.
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| Name: |
Chris
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 7:22:31 PM
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Another part of me thinks that some gorilla media warfare tactics may be better.
I have been pricing some billboards (the ones near the I-20 bridge) and election type yard signs. Tactics like this can stir up a lot of attention and a fecal storm.
Just an idea.
Your thoughts?
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| Name: |
twc
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 7:25:37 PM
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I hear ya. And please don't stop lurking. You've made some very great points and ideas.
As a new member of LMLPA, I'm thinking they should be in the lead on this. I know nothing at all about past leadership or issues but let's start with an established entity. I'm looking forward to the first meeting I attend and doing whatever I can to help. The only reason I haven't joined before is my own laziness.
I've been here 7 years and it sure looks like poor management on the part of APCO to me. 4 floods and 4 droughts just don't make much sense. And I won't go back over all the excuses they have given in the 7 years I've been around.
Let's roll with this y'all!
<><
TC
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| Name: |
MovinFr8
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/15/2012 11:41:28 PM
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I for one am not a fan of going the route of getting a tree hugger involved because once the pay attention to one aspect of out lake next thing you know it will be multiple others.
I know a handfull of the LMLPA are paying attention to this forum this year and I would like to suggest an angle that may be easy to gather data on.
LMLPA has a few volunteers around the lake that monitor the water (toxic levels maybe) - Is there an abnormal rise in any of the toxic levels when boat traffic rises and the water level is below 463 compared to when the level is above? If there is that may be the leverage we need to force the water to stay above 463 year around.
APCO shoreline management is highly aware of the toxins deep in the sedement and will go to great lengths to make sure that any seawall or such is monitored to reduce any unnecessary runnoff and proper removal of any unneeded dirt taken from the lake.
I have had a crappy day and am probably rambling so I hope someone out there can make heads or tails of what I am trying to make a point about. I may read this in the morning and clarify a few things then.
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| Name: |
jace
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 8:03:02 AM
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I like that idea a billboard and yard signs!!! that sounds quick and affordable
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| Name: |
bama dave
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 8:33:03 AM
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I don't know of many things that improved when the Federal government got involved.
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| Name: |
Wakeboarder
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 9:40:39 AM
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I agree that we should probably keep the feds as far away from our lake as possible. Witness the cluster that is now shoreline permitting (the Corps of Engineers is now involved and permits are taking forever to get processed).
I think we're on the right track and we stay the course. We've made a LOT of noise this year. I guarantee that this will resonate as APCO gets into their water management planning for next year.
The FERC adjustment to throttle Jordan was a huge win. Mike Riley with the LMLPA is passionate about lake levels, and has done a great job. I guarantee that while he is at the helm, this issue will continue to be at the forefront of LMLPA's agenda.
We've got to be vocal, and continuously be vocal. Join LMLPA. Come to the meetings. APCO will be there on July 19. Let them hear us, loud, clear, and repeatedly. The squeaky wheel gets oil, for sure.
And sound off on their Facebook page. They do pay attention to it, and they do react to feedback on that forum. www.facebook.com/alabamapower
Three Alabama Power representatives were at LakeFest last weekend, talking to vendors and local business people about the lake and lake levels. It seems like they've heard our rumblings, and are paying attention. They've even backtracked a bit on the "no summer pool" statement from earlier: http://www.dailyhome.com/view/full_story/18609568/article-APC-trying-to-preserve-water-to-fill-lakes?instance=home_news
There's my 2 cents. I appreciate the dialogue.
E
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| Name: |
DDA
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 11:34:03 AM
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I agree that LMLPA appears to be generating more focus on LML lake levels. Probably should have done it sooner, but after being a longtime lake user and homeowner for the past five years we joined LMLPA yesterday. Thank you Mike and team.
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| Name: |
John boy
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 8:37:53 PM
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I have a friend of mine that is a field reporter for a TV station in Birmingham, I could talk to him to see if the station would have an interest in doing a piece on how the people on Logan Martin lake are treated by APCO, ie lake levels , unnecessary flooding, loss on revenue in lake areas, etc.. Would this be something that you think would help???
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| Name: |
twc
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 9:00:11 PM
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I think that would be great! I would, however, defer judgement to Mr Riley. I only met him for a minute but he impressed me.
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| Name: |
MovinFr8
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/16/2012 9:43:45 PM
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I agree..... I think any effort we put forth should be coordinated through LMLPA.... I believe last year and especially this year have been extremely productive in getting the attention needed to our general concerns about the lake.
Yes the news brings a broader view to the situation but it should be with a schedule Mr Riley and LMLPA schedule.
My understanding is the next LMLPA meeting is July.... is that correct?
Is there anything that can be done before then? Membership drive? I understand last week was generally productive besides the weather. I will join at that meeting or see E this weekend to donate my membership funds.
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| Name: |
John boy
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/17/2012 9:34:05 AM (updated 5/17/2012 9:47:52 AM)
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Why do they not do like they do on the ocoea river for rafters and store the water at night at Jordan dam with a larger release on weekends during the day for rafting. This would seem to be a better use of the available water than to increase the release 24/7 365 days a year.
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| Name: |
John boy
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/17/2012 9:43:14 AM
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No I would NOT do anything without getting in touch with Mr. Riley first. That is the way it should be done 100%. Doesn't it seem strange that even with the rains last weekend that the lake level did not go up very much but when we all start coming together as a group the lake levels shoot up almost a foot in a couple of days.
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| Name: |
InjunJohn
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| Subject: |
Lake Level My 2 cents
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Date:
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5/20/2012 5:27:37 PM
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I can't be positive but I believe I just saw a "purple headed turtle bird" near the dam... anybody else see anything?
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