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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
What is going on here?
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Date:
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9/27/2010 10:48:03 PM
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Totally different topic but one that I have been thinking about a lot lately. Over the last few weeks I have experienced three suicides. All were very sad and all apparently for different reasons but with a common thread.
First, a father who was experiencing financial difficulties and could not deal with the problems. Left several small kids and a wife.
Second was a 23 year old young man who was a brilliant student but came from a troubled family life (divorced parents). He struggled with mental illness and depression but had a wide open future ahead of him.
Third was a junior at our kid's high school who was good looking, popular, intelligent and a very good student. Happened over the weekend and has had a big impact on our two daughters.
What is remarkably common in all these cases was the overwhelmingly positive impact each of these individuals had on others and the bright future each seemed to have. What I told my daughters was we all have demons and we all go to bad places in our lives but sometimes someone goes someplace that they can't get back from. In its essence I think people lose hope, begin to believe that people and the world would be better off without them, that they are actually doing something that helps others. In a prayer group I am in several men were quick to describe suicide as a selfish act, one that harms those you supposedly love but I am not sure it is that simple.
When I grew up in SW Pennsylvania in the 1970s the economy was terrible, steel mills and coal mines were closing and so many men lost hope. Several committed suicide, including a friend whose Dad jumped out of a window at the hospital and killed himself. Here we are 30-40 years later and it seems like we are back there again. Sorry for the morose topic but I am really thinking a lot about this topic a lot lately. Kind of makes politics and other daily B.S. seem inconsequential.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
What is going on here?
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Date:
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9/28/2010 8:11:02 AM
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Yes it is. It's particularly sad because there are good medications that can help depression. Intervention is key, but so many times the family either is embarassed or is in denial about what the person is going through. There is a stigma attached to depression as "mental illness"... we're supposed to be able to "snap out of it", but in the case of severe depression, there is both a physical and a psychological component, and they can't snap out of it.
And a lot of times once someone decides to take their life, they do seem to get better... this is because they finally have a "solution" to the crushing problems that seem insurmountable.
And the people around them are fooled and then devastated. It's very sad.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
What is going on here?
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Date:
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9/28/2010 9:56:35 AM
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I agree about intervention and medication. In one case (the 23 year old) it has been an ongoing battle and he was being treated but it didn't seem to help him. As for the young man at our school, I didn't know the family but they were shocked as were the kids at school. He was apparently very adept at hiding his demons which is all the more disconcerting. I am just bothered by the trend and its one I haven't experienced personally since the 1970s. Maybe just a coincidence.......I sure hope so.
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| Name: |
Summer Lover
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| Subject: |
VERY SELFISH act.
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Date:
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9/28/2010 10:53:26 AM
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From what I understand, those who commit suicide in a public manner are looking for sympathy, those who do so in a private manner are ashamed of something. A former boss committed suicide while in his house with a roommate. The roomie heard a noise and went to investigate - not a pretty sight, and I am sure that Rob will have nightmares until he dies. After the police "interview", he was cleared of any wrongdoing - talk about having a really crappy morning. I took the responsibility of notifying his former girlfriend and best friend - can't say that is how I wanted to spend my day. His family came into town for the funeral - this was a small business, so we were all like family anyway... I did NOT enjoy talking to a mother and a sister asking what happened, while a father grieves quietly to the side, trying to be strong for his family. I do not see how you can commit suicide if you have anyone who loves you that you care about.
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| Name: |
lamont
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| Subject: |
Have to disagree...
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Date:
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9/28/2010 2:38:02 PM
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Maybe
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Date:
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9/28/2010 2:43:08 PM
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While I agree it is essentially a selfish act I think there are some who truly are mentally ill (i.e., depression) that simply can't help themselves. Others convince themselves that the world will be a better place without them and their family will be better off as well. I don't remotely understand the psychology that gets someone to this point but there is no doubt in my mind that they lose hope. Without hope all is lost.
I seriously doubt they think it through and really comprehend the ramifications of their decision. It kind of goes to the issues they are dealing with that gets them to the point of seriously considering suicide anyway. Complex problem but I saw an article that suicide among middle aged men, particularly non-college educated, is on the rise.
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| Name: |
lamont
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| Subject: |
Woops... Hit that darn enter key to quickly
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Date:
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9/28/2010 2:46:38 PM
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I also attended a funeral of a suicide this week. The most gut wrenching funeral I have ever attended. This individual was on medications to "fix" the problems but, finally the demons won. My point is, this person was not lacking for love. She was absolutely adored by many as evidenced by the attendance at the funeral. She was absolutely not looking for sympathy. Probably 20 people, both young and old, got up to speak of their love for this individual. I just don't think you can lump all these people in a category. People have problems; some physical, some mental, some emotional, etc. Sometimes meds work, sometimes they actually escalate the problem. All I know is this person will be missed dearly.
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| Name: |
Summer Lover
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| Subject: |
My point
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Date:
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9/28/2010 3:06:29 PM
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Is that the survivors are truly the losers when someone takes their own life.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/28/2010 4:47:02 PM
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It can take a while for Drs. to find the right combinations of medicine for depression. Some people are merely getting meds from their family Drs, who mean well, but aren't necessarily as well versed in depression as a psychiatrist. sometimes people are reluctant to see an actual psychiatrist, because they think it is only for "crazy" people. Sometimes people have side effects from medications and they just stop taking them. There is such a thing as medication resistent depression, and there has been some success with shock therapy for these people.
Also medication alone isn't enough. There needs to be therapy with a qualified therapist to deal with the emotional component.
I know it is easy to say that it is a "selfish" act, because it is awful for the survivors. But if someone has never suffered from a crushing depression, it's hard to understand how hopeless things can come to seem for the sufferer.
Look at the young NFL player that committed suicide last week. 23 years old and in the NFL. By all accounts, his team mates and coaches never saw anything other than a charming young man.
It's really a pretty horrible disease. That's why it is so important to destygmatize it, so people aren't reluctant to get treatment. People are under a lot of pressure these days. Everything moves very quickly. There is a lot of pressure to produce, and to be successful. Not everyone can thrive in that environment. It's hard for some people to admit that they are sliding into the pit of depression.
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| Name: |
lamont
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/28/2010 5:58:33 PM
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Great post Hound. Some folks think these issues are so easy and cut and dried. They just are not. God Bless those that have not had to deal with this issue but, I have had to deal with it on a number of occasions. It is never easily understood and I just hate those that say it was a "selfish act," because sometimes it just is not. Hopefully those that believe that way never have to deal with it, cause I'm really concerned about how they would deal with it.
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| Name: |
Casey
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/29/2010 8:53:19 AM
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I just read that there's a kind of brain damage associated with athletes who've suffered repeated head blows. It's called chronic traumatic encephalopathy. The disease is also linked to depression and erratic behavior. I think the recent suicides, both of the U of Penn football player and the Denver Bronco wide receiver, were found to have this disease.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/29/2010 12:02:24 PM
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I've been reading about the brain injuries, did not know that they have linked it to depression. I'm so glad to see so much emphasis and research being done on this. So important, particularly with student athletes.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/29/2010 1:43:33 PM
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I had not heard of that but it doesn't surprise me. The brain is such a complex organ and I can't imagine that having multiple blows to the head is a good thing. I will say that many of the rule changes of late in football at least have been trying to avoid the more serious head injuries. Would be good if they could design a test to see if someone suffers from this or is prone to it.
Watching the news lately it seems there have been a rash of suicides all over the place. Maybe just a cluster and not a trend.....hope so.
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| Name: |
Casey
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/29/2010 5:10:53 PM
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You can 'google' it but here's a link to an article.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/14/sports/14football.html?_r=1&hp
URL: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/14/sports/14football.html?_r=1&hp
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Medication
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Date:
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9/29/2010 11:29:45 PM
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Interesting. My son played football for two years as an offensive and defensive lineman, including starting on varsity his senior year. Glad my wife didn't see this.
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